Kellee Wynne [00:00:03 - 00:00:22]
Well, hello. Hello, everyone. It's Kelly Wynn of the Made Remarkable podcast. And I
finally have another episode for you. I know it's been a little while. I've been off having
fun, seeing friends. Went to the artwork shop I told you I was gonna go to with Colleen
Atara. It was so beautiful.
Kellee Wynne [00:00:22 - 00:01:05]
Look, just the next time she opens up a spot and any of her workshops, snag it, I
promise you, you won't regret it. Anyhow, so I wanted to save this podcast episode for
you until I knew for sure I was opening up Build It Remarkable again. And I am. I am
really excited about it because finally we've got a date. I've got a special event for you
so we can celebrate the opening of my very cool, special, amazing, wonderful coaching
program. I don't know what else to call it. Like, it's Build It Remarkable. If you've heard
me on the podcast talk about it before, then you know it's very special to me.
Kellee Wynne [00:01:05 - 00:01:40]
I am in my fifth year of coaching. I know this is the longest I've done anything ever in
my life except for marriage and kids. But seriously, I've never had another job that's
lasted this long. I have been an art teacher. I've sold my art in galleries and done the
things and all of it, but I have never stuck with something for five years running. And
that's because this is it. This is where I know I'm meant to be. I show up in the coaching
calls and I help the most amazing women build their dreams.
Kellee Wynne [00:01:40 - 00:02:48]
And I don't know how else to explain it except for that it lights me up to be able to see
someone have the power to change their own life and to put more art out into this
world, more art education into this world, and to be able to change other people's lives,
it is the most epic ripple effect. I just don't. I don't know how else to explain it, except
for that this is the one thing I know I'm meant to do, and that is to help artists and
makers who want to share their gift with others and teach, whether it's in a course, a
membership, an online live workshop, an in person workshop, however it is you want to
package it up and share your gifts with others. I'm here to help you do that. And I've
been doing it now for almost five years. So it's my passion. And I have to tell you, Kat
Rains on the podcast today was my very first client. Her and three other people,
including Drew Steinbrecher.
Kellee Wynne [00:02:48 - 00:03:19]
I'm sure. You know him. He's been on the podcast as well. And so she graciously got on
the podcast and chatted with me earlier this year to talk about where she's at now. Now
we're looking at four years into her career as an art educator running her business. And,
yes, the student has surpassed the teacher, and I am incredibly proud of her for that.
I'm incredibly proud of what my students have done. My.
Kellee Wynne [00:03:19 - 00:04:07]
Whether I call students, clients, members, whatever, my people that I have spent my
time with and nurtured and cared for and watched them grow and watch them create
something so remarkable, I just. I'm here to brag about it. I'm here to brag about it
because I'm incredibly happy for all of you. You listen. A lot of my students are listening.
I'm incredibly happy for you to be able to create what you're doing in this world, to put
the love out there, to put the creativity out there, to change lives. And I know it
changes lives because I've gotten the emails and my. All of you, I know you've gotten
the emails before, too.
Kellee Wynne [00:04:07 - 00:05:23]
When someone says your work came at just the right time, the way you teach came at
the most pivotal moment of my life. And so then I know if I've gotten these messages
and my students have gotten these messages as they've put their art courses out
there, you can do the same thing. You can make that difference to the person who had
the brain injury and is just coming back to making art, to the person whose sister was
diagnosed with cancer, and you're helping them get through the hard times, to the
person who just lost their husband. All of these people come to us and say, it was your
class. Now, I'm not saying I'm the special one, but I'm saying that the art was there at
the right time for these people to help them, to heal them, to inspire them, to give
them new life and new meaning. And that's why the teachers keep teaching. That's why
I keep going to Colleen's to take glasses from her, because she also facilitates that
same exact experience. And if it wasn't for the artists and the makers who are willing to
put it out there and share how they do what they do, I think this would be a pretty sad,
lonely world.
Kellee Wynne [00:05:24 - 00:06:13]
I feel like the revolution is in what we do. Not everyone is on the front lines marching to
the beat of the drum. Some of us are behind the scenes, and we're creating art, and
we're creating it in a rebellious, big, spirited, amazing way that actually has an effect on
others that hard to describe. Because life isn't easy, folks. I'm sure you figured that out
yet. But when we have creativity, it heals the path. Along the way, it takes us to the
next step where light and life and art make it all worthwhile. And so I am saying to you
right now, I'm not asking you to come and build a business so you can be a
multimillionaire if that happens.
Kellee Wynne [00:06:13 - 00:06:48]
That's just the beautiful path that it takes us on. Wonderful. It's possible. I know it's
true. I've seen it a whole lot of times. But I'm asking you to ask yourself, am I willing to
put myself aside? Am I willing to put my fear aside? Am I willing to put the risk aside
and say, I want to help, I want to serve, I want to bring my art to other people. I want to
make a difference. Because if you have even a little bit of a nudge inside of you that
says, this is what I want to do, I want to be with other people.
Kellee Wynne [00:06:48 - 00:07:28]
I want to share what I know. I want to light them up. I want to give them the gift of what
I have, then you know what the calling. It's in you already. And so I ask you to take the
chance on yourself. And if you have that moment where you stop and you say, aren't
there already too many people teaching their art, Kelly? And I'm going to say, no. I
mean, how many books can you make? How many bestsellers can there be? How many
stories can we tell? No one ever says, are there too many books in the bookstore?
Right, Right. So I'm saying there's never too much art.
Kellee Wynne [00:07:28 - 00:08:16]
There's never too many classes or courses or workshops or zooms or retreats or
meeting in person. There's never too many. Because there's always going to be
somebody that you connect with, that you speak to, that needs the message, that
needs the creativity, that needs you to show up as who you are with the talent that you
have and the. And the message that you have in your heart. So on July 23rd, I am
hosting the Big Shift, and I'm specifically bringing back the Big Shift. I did this two years
ago. I'm bringing this back with the same title, because the message is the same. I
wanna shift something inside of you to see what's possible, not just for you, but for the
people that you'll be connecting with over the years to come.
Kellee Wynne [00:08:16 - 00:09:03]
As you bring your art to the surface and start creating in a meaningful way that helps
guide and teach others. And it's going to be super powerful. It's going to be an
experience. It's not about something that I'm just going to teach you the ABCs of
building the business. Yes, there's some concrete information because we all need the
real nuts and bolts. But this is gonna paint a picture for you of what's possible for you
and who you are and how you've come into this world with your creativity. It's gonna
give you those aha moments that you've been searching for. And we'll put those pieces
together so that you too can say, I see the vision, I see the big audacious dream and
I'm ready for it.
Kellee Wynne [00:09:03 - 00:09:50]
So if you will do me a favor, just go to kellyguyen.com shift and we're gonna do this.
There's no take backsies. I'm putting this out into this world come July 23rd. And yes, it
will be recorded. You don't have to show up live, but live is when the magic happens.
And it'll be about a week of us spending time together, really going in for the core of
who we are, right? Finding those big audacious dreams. And whether you're ready to
teach or not, I still encourage you to come to this experience because what it's going to
do is open you up to a whole new way of looking. That's where all of the, I don't know,
all the love resides.
Kellee Wynne [00:09:50 - 00:10:57]
And I can say that because I've just gotten back from Colleen's workshop where I. I
can't tell you exactly what it is, but man is their love. And if you've ever been in that
experience, if you've ever taught and you've felt it or you've been to a place where
someone's hosting and creating that experience for you, then, you know, that whole
thing, it just comes together and it's so good. So come to the big shift. And now I'm
gonna switch over and say, here is Kat Rains, fourth time on the podcast. I will link to
you previous episodes because she's totally worth listening to. Her history, where she's
been, how she became an art teacher, running her own business, being the collage
queen that she is. And now you'll get to listen to our fun chat and she's gonna explain
to you where she is now and what's happening and how her business is just exploding.
Kellee Wynne [00:10:57 - 00:11:10]
And I'm so excited for her and I'm so excited for you. So without much further ado, here
we are. Kat Raines. Hello, Kat, dear friend.
Catherine Rains [00:11:11 - 00:11:12]
Hello, Kelly.
Kellee Wynne [00:11:12 - 00:11:16]
Wynn. I'm so glad to have you here. I haven't seen you in so long.
Catherine Rains [00:11:17 - 00:11:19]
I know. It's been like ages.
Kellee Wynne [00:11:19 - 00:11:20]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:11:20 - 00:11:28]
At least it's weird after I'm talking to you weekly now. I don't talk to you but once every
six months or three months, whatever it is.
Kellee Wynne [00:11:28 - 00:11:38]
I know life got busy and you got really busy, but this is the time of year that you're just
finally winding down from your big launch for Collage Joy.
Catherine Rains [00:11:38 - 00:11:43]
I wish I were winding down. Not yet. I got another two or three months. But I will be.
Kellee Wynne [00:11:43 - 00:11:53]
Yes. So let's catch everyone up. They've listened probably to you on the podcast before,
which I love that you're always here at least once a year.
Catherine Rains [00:11:54 - 00:11:55]
I love that too.
Kellee Wynne [00:11:56 - 00:11:59]
But how are you now?
Catherine Rains [00:12:01 - 00:12:35]
How am I now? Oh, gosh, this is a big question. Like, I'm amazing. I mean, you know,
what's been happening the past two years is just like been on a roller coaster of
goodness. And it's also very high pitched. So it's like I'm. I'm learning, like day to day.
How do you handle growing in a wonderful way and at the same time having a life
that's grounded and. But it's.
Catherine Rains [00:12:35 - 00:12:46]
It's been a constant learning, you know, men. I was just talking to my VA today, see
how much I can not do. How I got to learn how not to do so much.
Kellee Wynne [00:12:46 - 00:12:52]
Right. Pass it on to someone else. Not be a perfectionist about everything.
Catherine Rains [00:12:53 - 00:13:03]
Okay. I can't give that up. But I'm trying. I really am trying. But it's, you know, I am a
little. A little on the detaily side.
Kellee Wynne [00:13:04 - 00:13:09]
Yeah. But that's because you want to deliver the best experience for your people.
Catherine Rains [00:13:09 - 00:13:11]
I do. And I have really, really high standards.
Kellee Wynne [00:13:12 - 00:13:12]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:13:12 - 00:13:28]
So I just like, I nitpick everything to make sure it's really good. Like right now, Collage
Joy is running. It's going great. Great. It's not good enough. You know, so I'm adding
more lessons today, so that takes me a lot more time. But that's what has to happen.
You grow and figure it out over time.
Catherine Rains [00:13:28 - 00:13:29]
Right?
Kellee Wynne [00:13:29 - 00:13:48]
Yeah. I think it's a learning process because you're about four years into the business, a
little past. We met at the end of 2021 and started coaching in 2022. You, Drew and two
other lovely people.
Catherine Rains [00:13:50 - 00:13:50]
Yes.
Kellee Wynne [00:13:51 - 00:13:53]
And now here you are. Things have changed radically.
Catherine Rains [00:13:54 - 00:14:08]
They've changed radically. I was telling you earlier to track my time in a five year
journal and you are all over 2022 because you changed my life, literally in 2022. It was
unbelievable.
Kellee Wynne [00:14:09 - 00:14:14]
Well, you have to believe. You had to believe in yourself first. That was the key.
Catherine Rains [00:14:15 - 00:14:41]
You know what? I don't know if I did. Cause I just had a dream. I just had this idea. And
then when you sent me your first email offering this coaching thing, it kind of planted
this little seed, like maybe, maybe I could make money doing this. I mean, I was. I was
already. My head was already there, but I didn't know if it was possible. But talking to
you is what really kind of not kind of accelerated the whole process from maybe I could
do this to.
Catherine Rains [00:14:42 - 00:14:53]
You had done it. You had made a lot of money selling art courses online. I said, okay,
maybe I can do this too. So it's really. You instilled belief in me. Honestly.
Kellee Wynne [00:14:53 - 00:15:12]
Thank you. Well, I saw determination the moment I met you. I saw that you were a little
frustrated over selling small products and not seeing a lot of growth that way. You know,
you were selling like calendars and small pieces of art and such.
Catherine Rains [00:15:13 - 00:15:40]
Yeah, yeah. So my intention when I quit my full time job, which was when I was 58
years old, was I was going to sell my art. I mean, what artist doesn't want to sell their
art? I mean, at least that's what you think. So it took me about four years just to figure
out what kind of. I knew it was collage, but I didn't know what my voice was. So it took
me four years to find it. And then once I found it, I started putting out collections. But
when you first start off, you can't sell your collections for much.
Catherine Rains [00:15:40 - 00:16:16]
You know, in order to get people to buy them, you have to go low. So I figured one year
I made like $3,500, and the next year I made like $13,000. And. And I was adding
products on. So you were. You know, I did a calendar every year, but that was like
$2,000 of my $13,000 income. And then I added on ornaments and greeting cards and
journals and. And when you put it all together, selling all of that and packaging and all
the time it took to market all those things because each one of those is a launch, and
launches take a lot of time.
Catherine Rains [00:16:17 - 00:16:20]
That was my 13,000. That was my highest year.
Kellee Wynne [00:16:20 - 00:16:23]
And how much of that was cost?
Catherine Rains [00:16:25 - 00:16:54]
We didn't even figure that out. I couldn't figure it out because the amount of hours
alone probably put me in the $1 an hour range between making the art. I had to
produce this Stuff, you know, I had to produce products and I loved it. It's just that I
couldn't find a way to make it lucrative. And I know that artists can make a living. As an
artist since selling fine art, it just takes time. It takes time to develop that following.
And, and to be honest, I don't have the time.
Catherine Rains [00:16:54 - 00:17:25]
I'm at the, at the second, the last stage of my life. And I'm young to me, but I don't
have, I don't have another 30 years to develop an audience, right? I'm doing it, I'm
doing it now. And my husband had always bugged me because I had a corporate job,
right, for 20 something years. And my corporate job was training. I was a training and
development person. And so I knew how to teach. So he was always saying, you teach
art, you should teach art. And to me that was like, teach art? Why would I teach art? I
want to sell my art.
Catherine Rains [00:17:25 - 00:17:59]
I want to be, I'm a full time artist. But now that I teach what I make, it's the most
creative thing I've ever done in my entire life. This is way beyond just making a collage.
This is inspiring thousands of people to step into their voice. Oh my God, it's the best
thing. I mean, this is a phase of my life where I'm teaching collage online. There'll be
another phase, I know where I'll be doing fine art, but it won't be for the purpose of
making a living from art. But I don't miss it at all because I am creative as hell every
day.
Catherine Rains [00:18:00 - 00:18:09]
It's everything. It's creating the lessons and figuring out business and figuring out ads
and all of it is the juiciest creative thing.
Kellee Wynne [00:18:10 - 00:18:35]
I would say that was the same thing I found trying to make it, selling art now with the
tools I have now, with the knowledge I have now, maybe I could go back to Kelly 2012
and say, hey, just stick to the one thing and this is how you do it and this is how you
sell your art. But it would still have limitation because it's physical product you have to
create, right? Digital is, is limitless.
Catherine Rains [00:18:36 - 00:19:00]
I always thought that. So when I was doing this art and I loved it and people respond, I
always sold out. So I would sell out whatever art I put up for sale online. The problem is
I, I was a factory. So I had to, you know, every three months I had to come up with
another 30 pieces. And you can't sell them for that much. So the math was just like, you
know, I would sell a piece of art for $75 because it was small. I mean, the p.
Catherine Rains [00:19:00 - 00:19:13]
I have collages that are behind me. They're all sold. But, you know, you can't sell little
art for that much. And that's what I was making, because I could make them fairly
quickly. But you also then can't sell them for much, you know, because they're small.
Kellee Wynne [00:19:14 - 00:19:32]
Yeah. Well, I get it. There's limitations. I had that aha moment, just like you. So let's talk
about the Kelly that showed up in your inbox touting her experience, which is legit. I did
the things I did.
Catherine Rains [00:19:33 - 00:19:34]
You did.
Kellee Wynne [00:19:34 - 00:19:56]
And I had a desire to help other artists, not be starving artists. Like, I knew this was
powerful stuff. I. And like you, I felt like building a business was incredibly creative,
incredibly rewarding. The amount of connection you make with other people, the
amount of lives that change because of what you're doing. And it's like there was. It
was beautiful. Right.
Kellee Wynne [00:19:56 - 00:20:08]
And so I agree. As I took my next steps, there was something calling me to mentor
other people and give them. Give them all my secrets, basically. And then you rose your
hand first.
Catherine Rains [00:20:09 - 00:20:12]
Was that at first, you and Drew
Kellee Wynne [00:20:12 - 00:20:14]
and Kelly and Christina.
Catherine Rains [00:20:15 - 00:20:34]
Right. So the Kelly that. It was interesting because about maybe two or three weeks
before, you popped into my inbox, which I told you that I actually had unsubscribed
from you years ago. Or maybe I. Or maybe I never subscribed, but I was never part of
your mailing list. And suddenly you just. I have no idea how you popped in there, and it
was like. Oh.
Catherine Rains [00:20:35 - 00:20:59]
And it was like you were not. Like you were handed to me. That's how I've always seen
it. Like, I put out to the universe. I need a teacher, because I have no idea how to
market an art class at all. I talked to a few other artists, but they didn't. They really
couldn't tell me the model. Like, how do you do this thing? And then you popped into
my box, and I remember thinking, God, that's a lot of money.
Catherine Rains [00:20:59 - 00:21:03]
And I wouldn't tell my husband what the. What I was going to be spending on you.
Kellee Wynne [00:21:03 - 00:21:06]
And she was pretty cheap in all things considered.
Catherine Rains [00:21:07 - 00:21:41]
Oh, now, I. I think you were. I think you were appropriately priced. But it felt
outrageous. Yeah. And it wasn't outrageous at all, because in three months, you told me
exactly what to do. And then I signed on for another three months, and you told me the
next part of it, and then I signed on again, and I basically got the whole model so in a
year, you and I developed my course that I still do, which is Collage Joy. It was just this
time four years ago that you sat with me over the phone and you went down the entire
model of Collage Joy.
Catherine Rains [00:21:41 - 00:21:43]
And I went, oh, my God, this is possible.
Kellee Wynne [00:21:43 - 00:21:46]
Yeah. Was it four years ago or five years ago?
Catherine Rains [00:21:46 - 00:21:57]
No, it's 2000. It was 2022. 2022. January 2022 we first talked. Yeah. And you approved
of my collage door.
Kellee Wynne [00:21:58 - 00:22:07]
Well, I did. I thought it was great. And I knew what it was going to take for you to build
it, and you built it. And you told me everything.
Catherine Rains [00:22:07 - 00:22:32]
You told me step by step, and it was so funny because I'm a marketer by trade. That's
what I did. You know, I was a training in marketing, but I had no idea that you had to.
You had to get an audience. Who knew? I mean, and then how do. And then how do you
get an audience? You know, I see so many people, marketing things, classes, and they
don't develop. They don't get the audience.
Kellee Wynne [00:22:32 - 00:22:57]
I know. So it's always heartbreaking to me when I meet people who are coming into my
program that have been. They've had art courses for a couple of years even, and had
no sales. And I'm like, how big is your email list? Can I ask? 150, 200, whatever it is.
And I'm like, okay, that will be rule number one. It's always rule number one. Build your
list. Right.
Catherine Rains [00:22:58 - 00:23:33]
Yeah. I mean, that's what you had me do in the very beginning, because. And I did. I
had an outline for a course, but this was like January, February, the first year I worked
with you. And I didn't even start filming a course until, like, September, because I think
from. From February to September, I was 100% developing an audience with, you know,
doing lives on Instagram. And then, even then, I mean, it was all marketing just to get
people to know who I was, to see that. Yeah, maybe I want to take a chance on this
Collage Joy thing, which came out a year later, you know, so it was a full year.
Kellee Wynne [00:23:33 - 00:24:14]
It was a full year. Well, you know, and that's the reason, after you. And doing it a couple
of times with people saying, okay, to finally get to the point where you're making a
substantial income. I know from scratch, it usually takes a year. It can take less time for
people who already have an established audience or a list or have made courses to. To
get them to where they want to go. But watching you, who you have enough people
following you already on Instagram, which, by the way, congratulations for far
outpacing me on your Instagram following. But you had some people there and you had
people asking how you make what you make, and that's always a good indication.
Kellee Wynne [00:24:14 - 00:24:38]
And I would say if whoever, who, whoever is listening right now has a bit of a following
and people are stopping and saying, I love what you do. How did you do what you do?
That's a good indication that your followers, one, are not your. Necessarily your buyers,
and two, you might be ready to. To sell. So you have that seed planted, and then I. And
then I fertilized it.
Catherine Rains [00:24:38 - 00:25:14]
Then you ramped it up. Yeah, actually, that is how I. That. And that is the bug that
finally hit me. So I. It was 2020 at the beach, and I was making this fast art because just
for the fun of it, and I was posting on Instagram during my summer vacation, and that
was the first time someone said, do you teach each? Can I take a class from you? And
as soon as someone said that, and I said, no, I don't. No, I don't do that because I sell
my art. And it took me another two years, but the bug got planted, like, oh, you want to
learn from me? But I didn't know how I was going to teach people what I did.
Catherine Rains [00:25:15 - 00:25:39]
So it took a while to, one, really get really firm. What do I do? Like, I had to really know
my art itself because it was kind of forming for a while. I was getting my voice actually
around, you know, 2020 is 2021. I was really kind of firming it up. And then after that,
people kept asking me, and so that's when the bug hit, and that's when you came into
my. My inbox. That's the perfect timing, as it always is.
Kellee Wynne [00:25:40 - 00:25:58]
Yeah, it's. It's also. It takes a while because you keep saying, no, of course I want to sell
my art. And a lot of artists and I. I'm not at all putting down people who want work hard
to sell their art. I think it's amazing. I kind of. Maybe I'm a little jealous because I didn't
figure out I didn't break the code on that one.
Kellee Wynne [00:25:59 - 00:26:30]
Well, I. At some point, I was like, you. I stopped and I started doing the math on what
was potential for. For teaching. And I'm like, okay, there's some real possibilities here.
And I will say I thought it was funny because when you first came in, you were like, I'll
be fine if I just make a hundred thousand Dollars a year, Which I know everyone who's
listening is like, I'd love to make a hundred thousand dollars a year. But I knew. I knew
you were ambitious, and I knew that that was too small of a number.
Kellee Wynne [00:26:32 - 00:26:44]
Once you cracked it in your brain, once you were like, oh, wait, digital products, online
products are limitless. It's just knowing how to put the pieces together to build it.
Catherine Rains [00:26:44 - 00:27:03]
Right. Yeah. I never thought I'd make over a hundred thousand. I remember hearing
another artist. He was pretty big in my mind, outline everything she did in a year to
make a hundred thousand. And I went, oh, my God, you make a hundred thousand. But
she was doing, like, 15, you know, things, and they were. And mainly it was around
selling art.
Catherine Rains [00:27:03 - 00:27:28]
She sold and she taught, and she sold calendars. You know, there's a lot of auxiliary
things which made me realize, oh, it is possible. But if selling art is the main thing, at
least for a while, you know, it takes a while to get a following so you can sell enough
and you have to make all the art, you know, so, yes, absolutely. You sell the art. You sell
the art, and then you have to replenish all the time. So it's just.
Kellee Wynne [00:27:28 - 00:28:00]
So I don't know who this person was that you were like, oh, she makes a hundred
thousand. But I just want to point out that she was doing all the things. But imagine if
she wasn't doing all the things, and she just picked one and went all in like you did. And
so once you realize that just doing the one thing would propel you to goals that you
didn't even know you had, like, that changed everything. Like, you are very solo
focused, you know?
Catherine Rains [00:28:01 - 00:28:11]
I guess I am. How do you make it? You're making me sink. Yeah, I really. I mean, I do
have a couple. A couple other side things I do, but almost everything is collage joy.
Kellee Wynne [00:28:11 - 00:28:33]
And I was coaching some people earlier today, and I was like, look at how Kat build it.
She did the one thing, and she put it on repeat until she got to her goal. She didn't add
more in. And she still has a fairly simple. She. You still have a very simple business
model. You have Claude, Joy, and a couple of supporting courses, and you teach
workshops.
Catherine Rains [00:28:34 - 00:28:35]
Yeah, it's.
Kellee Wynne [00:28:35 - 00:28:45]
It's very powerful what you've built. You've become known for it. And I am just. I have to
say, am I allowed to say I'm proud. Proud of you. I'm excited for you.
Catherine Rains [00:28:45 - 00:28:46]
Thank you.
Kellee Wynne [00:28:46 - 00:28:46]
So.
Catherine Rains [00:28:47 - 00:29:15]
So let me just say, Kelly, hold on. So I can't let you do that without me telling you back.
Because I've said this to you a million times, but there is zero chance that I'd be doing
what I'm doing now if I hadn't. If you hadn't gotten me here, because you literally took
me by the hand and told me, okay, no. Yes, do that. No. Yes. And I just followed you
because you had such credibility that I knew you were telling me the truth.
Catherine Rains [00:29:15 - 00:29:30]
And everything you told me to do worked. So you are the reason I am doing this. You
may. You. You made this. So, to me, this was a joint success. I just kept going. You know,
you taught me how to do it, and I just.
Catherine Rains [00:29:31 - 00:29:32]
I just kept doing what you taught me.
Kellee Wynne [00:29:33 - 00:29:34]
Sounds like you owe me dinner.
Catherine Rains [00:29:34 - 00:29:46]
I. Oh, I owe you so much. I. I owe you. I owe you being right here, telling the whole
world that you're amazing. Because that's how I feel about you. I always tell people
that. I tell everyone.
Catherine Rains [00:29:46 - 00:29:52]
Anyone will listen. Kelly Wynn's the one that taught me how to do this. That is the truth.
Well.
Kellee Wynne [00:29:52 - 00:30:16]
And I appreciate not only that you give me such high praise, but that you believed in
the process and you followed the process and that you let me basically test the process
on you, because I had not actually taught anyone else to do what I had done until I was
helping you and Drew and the first little cohort.
Catherine Rains [00:30:16 - 00:30:30]
But the reason I trusted you is because you already had enormous success selling art
workshops online. Yes, that is why I trusted you. Because you had credibility, and you
still have credibility. Thank you. You know. You know what you're doing.
Kellee Wynne [00:30:30 - 00:30:49]
I do. And I've refined the process so we get to the point a lot faster now. Um, and I. And
I. I'm not trying to just pat myself on my back, but I love the program. I love what's
come since you've come through. And I know you stuck with me for three years. So let's
be clear.
Kellee Wynne [00:30:49 - 00:30:53]
It wasn't just one year. It was three years of working together.
Catherine Rains [00:30:53 - 00:30:54]
Right.
Kellee Wynne [00:30:54 - 00:31:10]
But in that time, I've really figured out what works best. How to teach it more
effectively, how to get people to their goals faster. But it was because you took that
leap with me that I was able to take that first step into it.
Catherine Rains [00:31:10 - 00:31:28]
Yeah. Some of the things you've been telling me that you do now that you didn't do
then. That one sped me up, but you sped me up anyways. I already went to me really
fast. You know, it's gonna. See, I stayed with, you know, your program for three years
because I was growing every Single year.
Kellee Wynne [00:31:28 - 00:31:30]
Can we talk about now?
Catherine Rains [00:31:30 - 00:31:32]
I would grow faster knowing what you do now.
Kellee Wynne [00:31:32 - 00:32:11]
I would probably. But it's also a confidence thing. Well, I think you were pretty confident
to begin with, but, you know, you put these things into play, and I kind of want to talk
about what those first steps were in a simplest form so people understand that I gave
you a process, and I still believe in this to this day. It's like, do one significant piece of
content a week. Give them a juicy lead magnet. Not a boring lead magnet, a juicy one.
Get them on your newsletter. Nurture them back to that one significant piece of content
a week.
Kellee Wynne [00:32:12 - 00:32:30]
And the system I've used on repeat since then. And it works. And that's significant. That
significant piece of content also I call primary content machine was doing live teaching
on Instagram, because I would say back in 2022, people still paid attention to.
Catherine Rains [00:32:30 - 00:32:54]
Yeah. Yes. So that. That is what I did. So, in fact, I started it with the 100 day project. So
I did the Honey Project 2022. And my project was I was going to make one collage
paper a day for 100 days, 100 different kinds. And when I started off, I thought, can I
even find 100 different papers? And that's how it started.
Catherine Rains [00:32:54 - 00:33:04]
So I would go live teaching one paper a day from what I had done the week before in
the 100 day project. And I did that pretty much every week for a year.
Kellee Wynne [00:33:05 - 00:33:05]
Tune in Tuesday.
Catherine Rains [00:33:06 - 00:33:21]
Tune in Tuesday. And in the process, I barely. This is embarrassing to say, but I didn't
know how to make maybe, maybe five types of papers. And now I've got way over, I
don't know, 150 papers. Yeah, a lot. And.
Kellee Wynne [00:33:21 - 00:33:24]
And all of those without even using a jelly plate.
Catherine Rains [00:33:25 - 00:33:30]
Jelly plate. No, that's a little different. That's a whole different avenue. I can go. You can
add that.
Kellee Wynne [00:33:31 - 00:33:33]
You would open up a huge can of worms there.
Catherine Rains [00:33:34 - 00:33:49]
Yeah. I mean, there's enough to do without ever having a jelly plate, you know, So, I
mean, I have at least seven jelly plates. I just don't use them to make my papers. I use
them to look at. We're in my studio, you know, I have plenty of. You know how we all get
our.
Kellee Wynne [00:33:49 - 00:33:54]
I know we have to buy the things and try the things and decide if it's for us.
Catherine Rains [00:33:54 - 00:34:03]
Yeah. Well, it goes back to your one thing. You know, I could do jelly pads. I think they're
beautiful. I think, you know, I've. I've taken all of Drew's. Our friends.
Kellee Wynne [00:34:03 - 00:34:04]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:34:04 - 00:34:11]
All of his summits but you know, it's just. I like making papers without jelly pads. I don't
know why, I just do.
Kellee Wynne [00:34:11 - 00:34:16]
So that's good. But it was beautiful because you had a rhythm you could stick to.
Catherine Rains [00:34:16 - 00:34:16]
So.
Kellee Wynne [00:34:16 - 00:34:18]
And you built your list.
Catherine Rains [00:34:18 - 00:34:37]
I did. And so the two important things that you taught me right away was one, I had to.
People had to see what I did. They had to see that I, they. That I could teach, that they
liked my. The way I taught, they liked what I was teaching. So I had to show people that
live. So that was incredibly effective to build a list.
Catherine Rains [00:34:37 - 00:35:06]
And the second thing is I had to have a lead magnet. And instantly within the first two
months, I had developed what is called clutch kickstart. I still have that now. I mean, I.
I've massaged it some since then, but it is the thing that bring most people to me. You
know, they take my five day class and they stick with me. And then when collage joy
comes around, you know, hopefully they want to keep learning. So all doors lead to
collage joy.
Kellee Wynne [00:35:06 - 00:35:20]
Yes. And I love that you've just stayed very focused on that. And it's very effective. I
mean, you went from like a couple thousand people on your email list, maybe at most.
And they were mostly collectors.
Catherine Rains [00:35:21 - 00:35:25]
They were people that bought art. Right. So I had maybe 1900 when I started with you.
Kellee Wynne [00:35:25 - 00:35:28]
And that first year you were able to grow pretty quickly.
Catherine Rains [00:35:30 - 00:35:42]
Yeah, I, Yeah, I probably got the 10,000 the first year and then it's exponentially. Then
20,000, then 30,000. And this year I'm at 55,000 on my list. So it's grown a lot.
Kellee Wynne [00:35:43 - 00:36:12]
It has. And you perfected the launch. This is one thing that a lot of people are resistant
to, though. I teach other ways to sell, but I find I still believe that at least one live event
a year is one of the most effective ways to sell what you're doing. And you're kind of
proof in that because you've only. You only open the doors to collage joy once a year.
And every year you've been doubling and doubling and doubling.
Catherine Rains [00:36:13 - 00:36:17]
Well, you know, so the first year I did it, I didn't do a live event before my launch.
Kellee Wynne [00:36:18 - 00:36:18]
Right.
Catherine Rains [00:36:18 - 00:36:40]
And the second year you suggested it, and of course I said some cuss words around
that because, like what the. I don't have no time to put an event on, you know, but I
did. And I did collage. What was it called? Collage Kickstart Live was the first year. Yeah,
for 10 days. And in the second year it was Collage joy taster. Yes. And this year it was
collage breakthrough.
Kellee Wynne [00:36:40 - 00:36:42]
And you're sticking with breakthrough.
Catherine Rains [00:36:42 - 00:36:58]
I'm sticking with breakthrough. Yes. Finally I found the one. They all worked, you know,
because people need to. They need to experience what more than just what I was
teaching in college. Kickstart. The kickstart was kind of like the appetizer. Like, this is
what's possible.
Catherine Rains [00:36:59 - 00:37:00]
Breaks. It gives you more.
Kellee Wynne [00:37:00 - 00:37:01]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:37:01 - 00:37:07]
And, you know, then a fair number of people want to keep the. Continue with me, which
I'm, you know, I'm very honored.
Kellee Wynne [00:37:07 - 00:37:10]
Yeah. This year you had over a thousand people join you.
Catherine Rains [00:37:11 - 00:37:11]
I did.
Kellee Wynne [00:37:12 - 00:37:25]
And I am thrilled for you. I have never just on the record here. I have never had a
launch as big as you've had. Never. So kudos to you. It's quite an accomplishment.
Catherine Rains [00:37:25 - 00:37:28]
Thank you. Thank you for guiding me here because.
Kellee Wynne [00:37:28 - 00:37:38]
Well, I think that you've taken. Taken the reins and then flown with it. So. And I love it. I
love seeing what you're doing every single time. It's amazing.
Catherine Rains [00:37:39 - 00:37:39]
Thanks.
Kellee Wynne [00:37:39 - 00:37:57]
So. So what would you say is your biggest motivator now, moving forward? Because
you've accomplished a lot, Kat, but now, like, is there. Is there just more growth in the
future? Is there doing more, doing less? Is there.
Catherine Rains [00:37:57 - 00:38:37]
I'm trying to figure that out right now, Kelly, to be honest, like, it's so juicy and fun to
build this and to see the possibilities and to see one. The business itself is so cool to
run. But then you see all the people that are being affected by it all the incredible
collage joy. Students that are working, they're making these amazing things and finding
their voice. So it's like these two wonderful things I get to do. On the other hand, I don't
want to work quite so hard, and I work a lot, particularly from October through February.
It's pretty intense. I always say that.
Catherine Rains [00:38:37 - 00:38:47]
I never see the leaves go golden. I never think will turn. I don't really see holidays, you
know, so Christmas and Thanksgiving, I take one day off for each one of those and
that's.
Kellee Wynne [00:38:47 - 00:38:49]
And you're still full.
Catherine Rains [00:38:49 - 00:39:10]
I'm seven days a week because that's. That's what it takes to do breakthrough and
collage joy. But it'll soon get easier. I'll soon be on a nice, normal, what I consider 30 or
40 hour schedule. So it's always this balance. Like, what do I really. Where do I want to
take it? Because I know I can. It's so juicy to grow, and it's so fun to grow on the other
Hand.
Catherine Rains [00:39:11 - 00:39:43]
I want to read more books and I want to spend more time at the beach. And health is
everything, you know, So I spent a huge amount of time and money on making sure I'm
healthy. So I don't know, I'm trying to figure out like, how, where do I want to go? I know
collage joy is in my immediate future. I can see myself doing it. Minimum five more
years, maybe longer, you know, but we'll see. I mean, I love every second of it.
Eventually, long term, I want to make, I want to go back to making art. I could see
myself with an 85 year old woman in a.
Catherine Rains [00:39:43 - 00:40:11]
In my studio every single day making art. I don't know if I'll still be teaching classes
then because launching classes takes a bit of energy. It's very different than making art
where you're just kind of following the energy. I'm following the energy with producing
classes, but it's. The energy kind of takes me. You know, there's a, there's a wave and I
have to follow it. You know, once you start the ball rolling, you gotta follow the ball well.
Kellee Wynne [00:40:11 - 00:40:53]
And you chose January as your launch month, which does mean working through the
end of the year. And I would say, at least from my experience, we have our up time,
our, our get down and get dirty, get the work done time. And then we have our ease it
up time where we have breathing space to travel, to go to the beach, to read, to, you
know, spend more time doing the things that we love. But there are always going to be
the times in the business where it requires a little bit more of you. I'm hoping that it'll
require less time of you as you move forward because you have systems in place and
you've hired amazing people to help you.
Catherine Rains [00:40:54 - 00:41:01]
Yeah, it is already getting easier. I mean, I do have the most amazing assistant
imaginable.
Kellee Wynne [00:41:02 - 00:41:16]
Well, I know you have an amazing assistant. The most amazing assistant imaginal.
Because your assistant is the daughter of my assistant and my assistant is the most
amazing. And since their mother daughter, I know where they get it.
Catherine Rains [00:41:16 - 00:41:21]
I know they're both amazing. And I'm very, incredibly lucky. I mean, I found mine
through you also.
Kellee Wynne [00:41:21 - 00:41:22]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:41:22 - 00:41:23]
And I use yours too.
Kellee Wynne [00:41:23 - 00:41:24]
Yes.
Catherine Rains [00:41:25 - 00:41:47]
Because they're, they're, they both, they work together. Yeah. I need more help. That's
the bottom line. I need more people, or at least I need to throw more stuff off at my
incredible assistant so that I don't have to work so much. But that's, it's hard to give up
all the stuff you've always been doing. You know, it's like I've been writing down every
day, like, okay, Emily could do that. Oh, Emily could do that.
Catherine Rains [00:41:47 - 00:41:55]
Emily could do that. Because I. That's the only way I'm going to find time to read a book
is I give more up.
Kellee Wynne [00:41:55 - 00:42:01]
Yeah, you have to let other people do the work or you have to not do as much work or
not
Catherine Rains [00:42:01 - 00:42:06]
do as much, which is kind of part of the process. Like, how do you decide what not to
do?
Kellee Wynne [00:42:06 - 00:42:19]
Well, keeping to that simple system of your one long form content, your juicy lead
magnet, and your email. And those are the three most important things that you can
do. Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:42:19 - 00:42:49]
You know, it's interesting because so many people put out a lot of classes, and the
classes are great. I sign up for other people's online classes, but they have to keep
producing new ones. You know, having a big annual course, even though it's. It's hard
for the time that I have to put it together every year, it's a lot of hours. It's one course. I
don't have to keep recreating it. I just have to keep talking about the one course. So it
really does simplify my life.
Catherine Rains [00:42:49 - 00:43:04]
I'm not reproducing anything. I'm making things better. I mean, I always tweak and
make sure it still works and I refilm things, but I'm not coming up with new. So the new
stuff is I'm going to Europe, you know, as I teach in Europe.
Kellee Wynne [00:43:04 - 00:43:05]
And Morocco.
Catherine Rains [00:43:06 - 00:43:25]
And Morocco. And after that I'll go to Egypt and France. And so. But I. That's not really
the main income producer, you know, in fact, it's a very, very teeny little bit of what I
do that's kind of like, oh, I get to do that. You know, it's like, it's a treat. It is not the. The
income.
Catherine Rains [00:43:25 - 00:43:25]
It's.
Kellee Wynne [00:43:25 - 00:43:26]
Yeah.
Catherine Rains [00:43:26 - 00:43:30]
Little. It gets me to Europe for free. So.
Kellee Wynne [00:43:31 - 00:43:33]
To connect with your people, which is always an amazing.
Catherine Rains [00:43:33 - 00:43:47]
No, it's the coolest thing ever to meet people that took Collage Joy. And now, you know,
like, in Italy, there was like five or six people that took Collage Joy. We were like best
friends. In fact, they're coming to Morocco with me, so.
Kellee Wynne [00:43:47 - 00:43:48]
Oh, my goodness.
Catherine Rains [00:43:48 - 00:43:48]
I know.
Kellee Wynne [00:43:49 - 00:44:18]
I love that you're doing that. There's a little FOMO here about that. I. I was thinking
about picking back up and doing some art retreats again. But I'm sticking with my rule
of one, the thing that I tell people to do just Hone in on your thing. And my thing is build
it remarkable. You know, my thing is making it the best program out there. I mean, by
limiting how many people I take in also helps make it the best thing that I could.
Kellee Wynne [00:44:18 - 00:44:22]
I can do for other people and see their success. So.
Catherine Rains [00:44:22 - 00:44:49]
I agree. I agree. I think what. What you do is it. Well, not. Not sound corny, but I think
it's God's work, because you are one. You're following what is really what comes easy
and natural to you, and you're inspiring so many creatives to find their path, you know,
to find a way to do this. Because it is not what people think.
Catherine Rains [00:44:50 - 00:45:06]
I mean, they don't. They really think you just make a workshop and you put it out there,
and that is what makes them fail. Or when I say fail, they don't get the audience. They
don't get people signing up. You know, their workshops can be the best ever, but the
audience comes first.
Kellee Wynne [00:45:06 - 00:45:07]
It does.
Catherine Rains [00:45:07 - 00:45:14]
And I've told so many people that, and they don't believe me, you know, and they
continue to put out workshops instead of. You don't need to put out a workshop.
Kellee Wynne [00:45:14 - 00:45:15]
Right.
Catherine Rains [00:45:15 - 00:45:19]
You need to get an audience, and then you get the workshop. It's like, what comes first,
audience.
Kellee Wynne [00:45:19 - 00:45:32]
Well, and I think that's the fallacy. If I just make another workshop, then I'll sell it. But
you're selling it to the same people over and over again. And instead. Instead of that,
how about put your effort into growing the list? Everything comes back to the list,
though, right?
Catherine Rains [00:45:32 - 00:46:01]
You got to have a list, and you got to keep growing the list because your list will. Yeah, a
small, very small percentage of people will buy. And therefore, you have to continually
build the list and nurture the list and nurture the list, because people who, you know,
got on my list four years ago just now took cholesterol. You know, it took four years for
them to take collage to work because they weren't ready. It wasn't the right time in
their life. They didn't want to. Maybe they were still working. I mean, there's all kinds of
reasons.
Catherine Rains [00:46:02 - 00:46:05]
Their husband was sick, you know, so it takes time, but they stick with you.
Kellee Wynne [00:46:06 - 00:46:06]
Exactly.
Catherine Rains [00:46:07 - 00:46:31]
You know what I remember you telling me? I was, like, three months into working with
you, and you said, okay, now you need to start putting out a weekly newsletter. And I
went, you already have me going live once a week. I mean, you have me. I mean, I've
got. You had a whole list of things I had to do, and you want me to have a newsletter
once a week. And I did it and I had to. And I still do it. I still do a newsletter almost
every week.
Catherine Rains [00:46:31 - 00:46:36]
I miss maybe once every quarter. But that's what keeps people with me.
Kellee Wynne [00:46:36 - 00:47:33]
Once a week or every other week is essential because if you don't email them and then
suddenly you show up six months later, people are like, who is this and why am I on the
list? And they unsubscribe. But it's important to be nurturing them and building a real
relationship. And right now we're in like such a trust deficit with AI and with so many
scammers out there, so many people who are making offers that don't really
materialize right. As what they promised. So the more we can show up authentically,
show our face, talk to our people, help our people, even if they're just on our list, they
haven't paid a dime. It's okay. Because every single one of them is valuable in some
way. Whether it's just knowing that you're sparking some creativity in them and keeping
them and the hope alive, or one day they may make more art, whatever it is.
Kellee Wynne [00:47:33 - 00:47:52]
And it's like if you value each and every number on your list and realize that's not a
number, it's a human, and you continue to connect with them, that's when you end up
with building a real lasting business. And that's what you did. That's why people from
four years ago have stuck with you and now make the choice to be part of your
program.
Catherine Rains [00:47:53 - 00:48:12]
Right. You know, long term relationship building is part of it. That's the thing I tell my
other artist friends is like, you can't just do a newsletter every quarter. I mean, it's you
even monthly, I don't think is enough, you know, and the newsletter needs to be
focused not just on, this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm doing. This is what I'm doing.
Kellee Wynne [00:48:12 - 00:48:13]
Absolutely.
Catherine Rains [00:48:13 - 00:48:19]
It's got to be about what? Why? Why do people want to read it? You know, what? Yeah.
What's in it for them?
Kellee Wynne [00:48:19 - 00:48:20]
What's in it for them?
Catherine Rains [00:48:21 - 00:48:43]
And it takes time to find, you know, figure that out. Like, how can you offer something?
Because I didn't even think I could teach. How can I actually, how can I offer some? But
I could. I always could. I just didn't realize that people wanted to hear what I had. And
so it took me. It took a while, actually. The whole year that you had me developing my
audience, I was really figuring that out.
Catherine Rains [00:48:43 - 00:48:52]
I was Feeling okay. This is. I actually do have something to share. I do have expertise.
I've been a collage artist for over 30 years. It's not like I just stepped into this.
Kellee Wynne [00:48:53 - 00:48:53]
Right.
Catherine Rains [00:48:53 - 00:49:06]
But I did kind of. I minimized what I knew. And so once I started doing the audience and
I started putting these papers out there and people were responding to it, I said, oh, I
do know how to do this.
Kellee Wynne [00:49:06 - 00:49:07]
Yes.
Catherine Rains [00:49:07 - 00:49:16]
So it was kind of like. It was like one step at a time. It wasn't like I just started teaching
Collage Joy. It was this long process. And it's still a long. It's still a process.
Kellee Wynne [00:49:16 - 00:49:17]
It's still a process.
Catherine Rains [00:49:17 - 00:49:19]
I'm still figuring this thing out.
Kellee Wynne [00:49:19 - 00:49:40]
I think you're doing a pretty amazing job, though. So you have a few fun things coming
up. What's the highlight of 2026? Now that you've already launched Claus Joy and you
are loving on your people and teaching them, that means you have until next year,
January, before your next launch.
Catherine Rains [00:49:40 - 00:50:18]
So I wish it was what you just said, like, oh, you have all this time. 1. I'm at the
beginning of Collage Joy. So I've got another. I have until May, where I'm rolling classes
out and I'm massaging them and, you know, making sure all the content is the best it
can be for students that are in the class right now. So that takes up a huge amount of
my time between now and May. But then in June, I'm launching my first community, and
we're initially, you know, it'll be for Collage Joy alums, and then we'll eventually open it
up for other people that want to learn collage that will launch in June. So I'm actively
working on that.
Catherine Rains [00:50:18 - 00:50:27]
And then in September, I'm going to France for a week to teach, and then Morocco for
three weeks, and then I start Collage Joy.
Kellee Wynne [00:50:27 - 00:50:30]
And then you start working on the next launch of Collage Joy.
Catherine Rains [00:50:31 - 00:50:41]
Yeah, probably September is when I start launching. Start working on. Actually, I work
on it all year round. What am I talking about? I've already have dates set up for the next
Collage Joy.
Kellee Wynne [00:50:41 - 00:50:59]
But that's how we do it. When we plan it that far in advance, then maybe there's a little
less work to do. I say that as I'm sitting here going, dang, I have so much to do because
I'm opening the doors to build art. Remarkable. Well, you know, like, it's always
something to do, but it's also kind of exciting.
Catherine Rains [00:51:00 - 00:51:21]
Oh, it's so exciting. And what you Offer is so meaty. Like, you tell me all the changes
that are. That you've made, and it's like, yeah, I mean, I'm glad I found you when I
found it, but I. I would have liked to have done it now because I like how you're. How
you're teaching it more. I mean, it was great because I'm here.
Kellee Wynne [00:51:21 - 00:51:25]
Well, the advantage of when you found me is that we got a lot of one on one time.
Catherine Rains [00:51:26 - 00:51:27]
We got a lot of one on one.
Kellee Wynne [00:51:27 - 00:51:28]
We did.
Catherine Rains [00:51:28 - 00:51:47]
You held my hand, and look at you now. Look at me now. It's funny, I go to different
events. I had a breakfast this morning with the chamber of commerce, and people say,
what do you do? What's up? I produce online art classes. They go, oh, no idea.
Kellee Wynne [00:51:47 - 00:51:52]
That you make more than a doctor. Sure, fine. Go ahead and look down on me.
Catherine Rains [00:51:53 - 00:51:58]
I don't know if they look down on me. They just don't know what I'm doing, you know?
No, they go, oh, okay.
Kellee Wynne [00:51:58 - 00:52:00]
Nice, Nice little art.
Catherine Rains [00:52:01 - 00:52:04]
I have a little hobby, her little art business hobby.
Kellee Wynne [00:52:05 - 00:52:17]
My favorite thing is to. Is to help women make their own income, build their own
business, change their lives, create more opportunities. And. And it's happening, and I
love seeing it.
Catherine Rains [00:52:19 - 00:52:22]
Well, you are putting a lot of goodness in the world, my dear.
Kellee Wynne [00:52:22 - 00:52:22]
Thank you so much.
Catherine Rains [00:52:22 - 00:52:45]
You're helping a lot of people bloom, because I know I wouldn't have bloomed, Drew
wouldn't have bloomed without you. You have a lot of bloomers. A lot of people that I
know that you've helped them step into the world and make a. Make a viable income,
you know, from something they love doing. So I'm. I'll never say it enough. I'm eternally
grateful to you.
Kellee Wynne [00:52:45 - 00:53:07]
Thank you so much, Kat. I'm so glad to see you again and have you on the podcast. I
will make sure everybody knows how to find you and go sign up for Collage Kickstart so
that they get a taste of what you do and find you on your YouTube channel. Because if
you've ever wanted to make handmade papers without a jelly plate, there is so much to
absorb there.
Catherine Rains [00:53:09 - 00:53:13]
Yes. Please come take Kickstart. That would be wonderful. I'd love to have you.
Kellee Wynne [00:53:13 - 00:53:24]
Thank you so much for being here and thank you for being a friend. And I'm glad that
all of the education turned into a lifelong relationship with you because you're an
amazing person, Kat.
Catherine Rains [00:53:25 - 00:53:27]
I love you too, Kelly. I love you.
Kellee Wynne [00:53:27 - 00:53:31]
All right, till the next time on the podcast. Bye.
Catherine Rains [00:53:31 - 00:53:32]
Bye