Selfies, Gurus and Consistency

Kellee 0:08
You're listening to Unfold with Kellee Wynne this is an unpolished, imperfect and totally honest podcast, and I'm talking to all artists, creatives, visionaries, and changemakers, who want to live a life by design and not by default. If you're ready to have thought provoking eye opening and heart centred conversations, that explore the stories that made us who we are, and break through the boundaries of expectations, then you are in the right place.

Kellee 0:41
Well, hello, hello, welcome back to Unfold with Kellee Wynne, I am thrilled to bring you this episode because it is part two and three of a Q & A series I did on Instagram. And I actually find it quite inspiring. Still, at this point, I'm listening back over and I'm like, hey, there was some pretty decent points this lady was making. That being me, of course, I know, I know. How cheeky of me, but I really love the discussions that we have when we're live on Instagram together, I feed off of your energy, I love to be able to answer your questions. And so. I do these live sessions with you after the podcast. I actually have been doing live sessions now for several years. But right now, when we show up live, I get to review whatever the topic was on the podcast and share it with you. And we're talking in this episode right after I did podcast episode two, and talking about everything that you don't need in your business to get started. And so I talked about some of the things you do need, I talked about the very dramatically changing landscape of the art business world, everything from where we were before the recession to how the pandemic has changed it that kind of shifted everything. But I think some of the most important points that you're gonna get out of this episode is consistency is key. Showing up repeatedly doing something over time, will make all the difference in the world in building your business. And also go get those photos taken. Now, it doesn't matter. You don't need to lose 20 pounds. Okay, I'm telling you just do it. Let's get this thing going. All right, enjoy the podcast.

Kellee 2:23
Ready to welcome everyone on. So hopefully you're coming on now telling everyone, I'm here. Let's chat. Tell your friends, tag your friends, tell them to come. If you're watching this on replay, tell somebody they need to listen to Unfold with Kellee Wynne. That's why we're here. That's what we're talking about. So thank you, everyone for joining me. Ah, running a podcast is kind of interesting and fun. And I'm connecting with all kinds of new people. And I love it. I love, I don't know, 2022 is off to a good start for me, I hope it's off to a good start for you. I'm here to hopefully answer your questions, inspire you keep you going. Share with you the shifts that are happening with me. And my number one purpose is to help you live a life by design and not by default. That's my theme for the whole year.

Kellee 3:17
So how are you doing? I see a bunch of you joining. How's the weather, it's freezing cold on the East Coast, I think we're supposed to get snow again. But look, I used to have such strong preferences for certain kinds of weather. And now, I'm just glad every day that there is weather and that we're alive, and we're breathing air. And so I just got the flow. And I literally am so much more chill. I think the 40s, your 40s that starts happening more and more. So if you're not there yet, it's all about just going with the groove. You can't control the weather. Did you know that? So you can either hate it or you can love it. That's how I feel. That's how I feel about it, have to decide what are your values. And since we talk about business a bit on the podcast, business, creativity and the whole self person that's kind of my goal is to put those three things together.

Kellee 4:11
But in order to build a business that's aligned with who you are, you have to know what your values are. And I'm not just talking about tell the truth kind of values those aren't important. But the kind of values of like what do you value out of life? What do you what is most important to you? What are you willing to sacrifice, and what's an absolute no. Like, I don't want to give up family time. I don't want to give up travel. And I don't want to give up my peace of mind. Anything that's crossing the line, that takes away from that means it's not the right business for me. And and I'm really, to me, it's really incredibly important that everything I do is done with integrity, no manipulation, no patriarchal capitalist, bro marketing techniques where I'm manipulating anyone and to feel looking like they're obligated to take a course or a programme from me, then that doesn't feel right to me. So I show up, I tell you the truth, I'm flat out freaking honest with you about everything. And if it resonates, and you feel like you're ready to participate in something that I have to offer them awesome. I am not about getting over objections and convincing people to do things with me like I just that that kind of marketing is like really beyond me, authentic showing up. That's what's important. And that's what I teach. If you ever take a course for me in business, as I start to build the business side of my whole, like teaching business and coaching business, I've already started with one mastermind of the most amazing four people, perfect little group. That's what I teach. It's about showing up and being authentic.

Kellee 5:50
And since the podcast episode two was about what everything you don't need to get started, I will tell you, let's just start with what we do need. We need values, we need boundaries, we need some self love. We need to be able to make our art with clarity and confidence, which is really probably the hardest of all of those things. And then we need to show up. That's it, you want to build a beautiful business, those are the most important things that you're going to do. So 99% of building a business is mindset of who you are, how you show up, how you communicate, and how you just kind of keep going even when it's hard. Everything else. There's no fast rule. So if someone's trying to sell you a programme that says this is the only way to do it, you have to do it with webinars, you have to do it with Facebook ads, you're only gonna be able to sell your programmes or your courses or your product or whatever with a Facebook group. If anyone tells you there's only one way to do it, run the other way. Because that's not true. Building your business, selling your art, selling your courses, selling your coaching programme, the most important thing is showing up and being yourself.

Kellee 7:03
And so in my Podcast, episode two, my theme was everything you don't need to get started with your art business, so your brand new art business, you're like ready to go. And I tell you and I'm here to break down, I can tell you all the things I spent money on that was a total and time which is almost more valuable than money over the last 10 years that I didn't need to do, and I'm willing to answer you. But first, I want you to ask me questions, who's enjoying the podcast? who actually spent the time to listen to the prologues? because the prologues have a lot of information that kind of sets up the rest of the entire series that I'm working on here.

Kellee 7:45
So I am enjoying this podcast process. I'm learning a lot, I still haven't found my footing completely, but I'm getting better at it. I did have a couple of questions before we started, people sent emails to me. And I forgot name. So forgive me, I'm really terrible with names. But one question was about networking, which I find to be very useful question and very powerful and very essential. So let's just jump right into the question was about networking with your local artists in your area. And that's really how I got started. In fact, some of my best friends are still artists that well, one of my very best friends is is an artist that I met through networking here. That networking really set me up a strong foundation for seeing how other artists did things I learned from them, I learned how to hang on art show I learned how to resource and find new possibilities of how to sell, like maybe at a restaurant or a coffee shop, fairs and festivals. Like this is how you network and find everything that's happening in your area. And every artist kind of has a different way of doing it, especially depending on the style of art that they make. We have a lot of artists in our area that are very location specific. So think Annapolis, Maryland, the Chesapeake Bay, so a lot of see ocean related themes. That wasn't a direction I really wanted to go in. But I still saw how they maximise that to their advantage. And that's fantastic. They became so sought after that they couldn't keep you know, there aren't in stock, which is great.

Kellee 9:32
So if you have a very, very deep connection to where you live and you're making art that's representative of where you live, find other artists that do the same thing. What networking does is it just really teaches you whether it's online or in person but in person is really nice when you get started because it's so nice to have actual human friends and not just a screen to talk to. It's a huge shift too, so I find that it's just really helpful to talk to other artists. I'm not as involved in the art scene here, because a lot of my business just took me online and I network a lot online, I make new friends all the time online. And I find that that's been really, especially in the last two years with COVID. It's been really fulfilling to be able to make friendships all over the world, but networking will teach you a lot.

Kellee 10:25
The other part of the question was about doing fairs and festivals, specifically, like the big festivals, like we have one in Baltimore, every summer we had one. Look, I say it as if it's still going on, I don't know with COVID. What's, what's gonna happen, what's not, but I'm assuming this big art festival will happen again. And I know people who've participated in them, they do great, sometimes they sell really a ton of work. And when you do those big festivals, a lot of times, you learn a lot about what your customer likes, and how to communicate better with your customers. So festivals, pop up shops, anytime that you can just show up with your work and communicate with your customer, you're going to learn a lot, not every single time are you going to sell a lot. And I chose not to do most of those big festivals because they were so much work, you need a tent, you need a really well put up the not just the tent, but the entire display needs to be done, you have to be ready to do that kind of work and haul it have a car big enough to haul that and all the art to put up. If this is the route you go, then you find all the festivals, apply to all of them, know the rules, know the tax laws, and you do it and you make it a big part of your, you know, spring through fall lineup of how you're going to sell your art.

Kellee 11:45
I think the key is to find what you like to do, to sell your art and do it and do it consistently. If you're just going to do one festival a year, I don't think you're going to find the results that you want. The investment, the time, the planning, it's when you do it, and you learn from it. And then you do it again. And it's the same with like maybe having a big art sale online, you do it, you learn from it, you do it again. It's the same when I launched an art course I learned from it. I adjust, I kind of like shift what worked, what didn't work. And I do it again. And you keep doing it until like one of two things that clicks and you become a master at it or two, you decided is so not for you. And you need to shift directions again. But if you only do it once, or randomly or occasionally you show up to talk about your art, you're going to make such slow progress, it's going to feel like you're getting nowhere and you're probably going to quit.

Kellee 12:41
It's those who keep showing up and showing up over and over and over again with whatever decision they make. You want to go all in on tick tock, you want to go all in on Instagram, you're gonna go all in on YouTube, to build your business, pick one place, you want to do everything as a Facebook group, it doesn't matter. Just pick one thing, there is no perfect place for you to build your business. What's best is what you enjoy doing and what you can do consistently. And I talk about that a bit in the podcast is this idea of perfectionism and overwhelm of all the things we think we're supposed to do. You don't need a logo, you do not need a perfectly branded website, you do not need professional headshots. And you do not need to lose any weight in order to do this, because this is something us women oftentimes have in our head, like, oh, I can't do this photoshoot until I've lost another 20 pounds, which I've been saying for the last three years that I need to lose 20 pounds, and then I'm gonna have a fantastic photoshoot until I finally realised I am who I am. And I better just show up, right? So turn your camera on selfie mode with a timer, propped up your art behind you. You know, make yourself look good, wear black, because black is slimming secret little, you know. Make sure you're in a bright room. This is natural light coming in from a window. So on a bright day that makes it very helpful. And then just snap like 100 pictures, do silly things. And then suddenly you have an entire portfolio of photos you can use to build your business, nothing needs to be perfect. Do you hear what I'm saying? You do not need to be perfect to get this business started. You do not need to spend money to get your business started.

Kellee 12:41
What you need is to show up consistently in one place wherever you choose that platform to be because you need an audience. And that might be physical locations, consistently. And you need to be able to show up. And you need to be able to know your art and talk be able to talk about your art. And I kind of review all of these and all the things I tried on the podcast. So look, make the list. I've tried it all and I know that my inconsistency on some of it probably was the reason why it didn't work out, but some of it was because I didn't enjoy it. And once I clicked on the thing that I loved, I stuck with and for me, it's educating online, I love it, I love it more when we're live together than even when I record videos, I love the chance to connect with you. I just I don't even know how to explain it like, I know, that's my thing. You might not like the always being in front of people. So there might be a behind the scenes thing that you're better at. But you still need to show up. And you still need to be able to talk about your art, you need to fall in love with your art making process, whether you're selling your art, or you're teaching how to do your art, or you're teaching people how to build a business, or you're coaching them, or you're creating a community programme around your art and your creativity. You need to fall in love with your process, and know how you make your art and know how to talk about it, to have the story to have the joy and the it just kind of oozes out of you. And that's how you're going to be able to do your very best when you build a business.

Kellee 16:00
So it takes practice, because if you're shy, or if you're you have filled with the imposter syndrome or doubt, it takes practice to get through that. Which is why I'm here to try and talk to you and encourage you and tell you it's going to be fine. And we'll work through it together. Find yourself a support system, some friends, online, a coach, a mastermind, a community a membership, there's some so many great memberships, where you'll find other artists that can give you the support you need as you get going. There's nothing that's going to be able to get you further, faster than a group of other people who are in the same boat as you that can encourage you and empathise with you and give you the cheers and shouts that you need. It's so important. So I know we have another question here, I'm gonna go back. It's a little ways back because you guys are so awesome. You keep joining us, some of you join and pop out again. And I hope that you're watching this in.

Kellee 16:56
Ellen, it was talking about the fairs and festivals, some of them do have high rental fees. And some like the real professional ones, when you're talking about like, buy art basil, which we wouldn't most of us listening to me today, including myself couldn't really get into because it's for the ones that are selling 10s of thousands of dollars for artwork usually. And those are like ridiculous, you usually need the gallery to sponsor you. But some of the ones in between are five to $10,000 for these art fairs. Again, that's a little bit higher market. So if you're there on that point, go for it. But a lot of them the fees are somewhere between 100 to 500, maybe. So it's really you can get back your investment. But it's a lot of work. So you just have to decide if that's the path you want to go.

Kellee 17:49
Let's see, we had another question. I love it. When you guys ask questions. Allison is asking, what was the biggest obstacle I experienced in the growth of my business? That right there, that's my biggest obstacle, it's going to be your biggest obstacle as well. And I know you want something more concrete than that. But only in hindsight, as I look back over the last decade, can I say...the power of your mind and what you think about what you're capable of doing. The knowledge that you gain, all of the perfectionism, the should do the market standards and comparison with other artists that are doing, you know that are doing so well, like you think they're perfect. All of those are going to be your biggest obstacles to your success, which is why probably 75% of what I'm going to be talking about here on my lives and in my podcast is mindset because really, this is the path to joy. It's the path to happier relationships is the path to success and wealth. When we figure out how our mind is tripping us up over and over again. We can move so much more quickly past what needs to be done.

Kellee 19:09
I've always been very determined, like I knew, I knew I always wanted a business. And I knew that once I came back to art that my goal was to build a business from art. So it wasn't like it was like some little hobby that I've suddenly stumbled into selling. I made a concerted effort. I spent time studying how to make art the way I wanted to make art and that's still evolving. And then I tried everything under the sun. So my determination helped pull me through. But there's so much I've learned now about how my mind would hold me back like it's not possible to sell art at high prices. Well, I never communicated the value of my art. I never believe that that customer was just right around the corner and I just needed to show up and talk about it. Like these are things that the marketing secrets of marketing is showing up and marketing, marketing and branding are like my favourite subject, which is why I'm kind of building the bulk of my business towards marketing and branding. Because everything else is just tedious work that you have to figure out like hiring systems, money, taxes, I mean taxes, not money, because money is an important part of marketing and branding, but, and I work through those things, and I get help for those things. But the part that really like blows up your success is learning how to communicate what's in your heart. That's it, that's the most important thing. So the mindset is the biggest thing to get over when it comes to your success. So that hurdle was really hard. I'm sure that I could go through a lot of other hurdles, like just just figuring out the time it takes just to figure everything out. And I definitely wish that I had had helped sooner like understanding the market.

Kellee 20:53
But even with my father, having been a successful artists, the world changed so much from 2008, when the market crashed to the sudden glut of social media, which started really picking up in the mid 2010s. And that just really changed the entire outlook on how we do business. And then you have the pandemic, and that shifted everything again. So I've seen so many changes from 2008 until now. And every time it's like you just have to shift with the wind. But the one thing that stayed the same as me showing up so when people ask, how did you do it? How did you get 53,000 followers on Instagram? I just fucking showed up every day, guys. That's it. I showed up. I was generous with what I could share. I talked to other people I networked, I collaborated. This is mostly an organic growth I very rarely have ever paid for Facebook ads is just for me, the organic growth is essential.

Kellee 21:53
So please ask more questions as we're going because I still have time to spend with you at least another 10 or 15 minutes to answer what it is that you need to know about what you don't need to get started. That's my goal is for you to understand, you don't need all the things.

Kellee 22:11
Go to canva.com. If you have never heard of Canva ca n v a.com. You can design anything you want. And it's free. But I have the paid programme. And it's amazing. It's so like that is more valuable than than any designer I can hire. It's just amazing. There you go. There's all your graphics and designs, if you want to know how it's done. You don't need to hire someone, you don't need a perfect brand. It's your name and your art that is your brand. It's how you show up and you talk. am I crazy? or is it resonating with you that it can be that simple? I want you to understand that it's not easy, but it's simple. Does that make sense? It's a lot of work. But it's not complicated. It's just consistency.

Kellee 23:01
So Laura is asking what are the best topics or way to talk about your art? journal it I'm I'm not much of a journaler. But I have been convinced now by a couple of people in the last couple of weeks that this is what I need to be doing, is writing down my thoughts and ideas about my work, as I make the work as I reflect on it. And I've actually started a new practice, this is brand new. So even though I'm sharing it with you, because I just want you to know, this is my discovery, I am not an expert, I am learning how to meditate. It is a very powerful thing. I don't believe in doing it perfectly. Because that whole thing, empty your mind and just sit still is not exactly what meditation is about. It's about communicating with yourself. And not necessarily having a discussion but just kind of sitting there. If the ideas pass, you let them pass and don't hover over them.

Kellee 23:54
But sometimes what I do is take the time to meditate on my process because I haven't made a lot of work in the last two years and I've discussed this very clearly I'm open about it. My business burnt me out and it's taken me a lot of time to come back. But that excitement and juices coming back like a roaring tiger right now. So I will just meditate on the process, not the finished work. But how I feel as I do it, how I'm making the motion, almost like a dance. So try that. Try journaling, try meditating on your work, try tuning into why, how and this doesn't matter what you're selling, it doesn't matter if you're just selling prints of your work or you're selling a course or you're doing coaching or you want to sell fine art and big galleries. This is your best way to communicate is to tap into yourself. So there you go. That's my advice. Is is really your why, your purpose. Be interesting about it, share everything. Don't hold back. Don't think that everybody just wants this esoteric idea of why you make art. No one wants that. They want you that's why they come to you. Alot of times people are buying the art because they fall in love with you, and they like your art. Can you believe that? That's the truth.

Kellee 25:09
I love this, how integral was your email list to your growth, I will say an email list really makes a huge difference. And I am going to cover this in the in the months to come. Because I'm probably will have little mini workshops where we can, like do one of the components of building your business and do it well. But having an email list does make a difference. Because as you've noticed, social media is not reliable. I mentioned this in my podcast. And it's really easy, because you can go there several places, MailChimp, mailer light, they all have like some free options until you're ready to pay for more, building an email list, whatever that is, however, that works for you. But getting people to start getting on an email list is far more effective than relying on the algorithm of social media. So I really do recommend it, I can tell like I do work on like tracking statistics of where my sales come from, or where my relationships are built from. And I can always see that the email, this makes a big difference. But it's taken me years. So I've opened my first email list probably in 2014, maybe. And it's taken me years to build it. But it's worth it. Start now because giveaways don't work anymore. Don't worry about a giveaway. That's your honest answer, Jill, who asked, hi, do we need to give away No, they don't work anymore. I was just talking about this with an artist last night. Literally, she's like, I used to do giveaways to build my list or whatever, doesn't work anymore. I think a lot of those kinds of things have worked in the past and once it's been seen and done too much. So I just... it's no harm in trying, if you want to put the work into it, it's not really going to cost you much other than to give something away and mail it. But I found anytime I've tried it even five years ago, it really didn't boost my list the way I expected it to I wouldn't see much growth on my Instagram, I wouldn't see a whole lot of people joining my email. What does work is giving value. And I'm not talking about a free giveaway. But what can you offer in service. Some people have said beyond my email, like if you're selling art, if your only goal is to sell art, and you're not interested in the other things that I teach, which is coaching, courses, creative programmes and such like that, because that's really what I'm an expert at more so than selling. But even this applies to artists who are selling their artwork to build that email list, there needs to be value. And I'm not talking about some free giveaway, download this list, those can be nice. I'm not saying don't do it. That's like the little bonus. The value is when you're on my email list, I'm going to be sharing with you a couple times a month, I'm going to tell you behind the scenes secrets, I'm going to show you the art first if you're if you're my on my collectors list, if you're on my list to get my art course, you're gonna get behind the scenes details, it's showing the value of the email list is how you're going to build that faster, rather than some gimmick like, just just a free download, like make, I'm not sad, because I have free downloads, I love free downloads, but the list itself, the people on that list, you want them to stay on the email list, and continue to open up your emails and read from you and connect with you and answer your emails and want to be part of your you know, your your circle. So about email lists, it's really about, again, providing value. And that's the same thing when you show up on Instagram and try to build your audience, if everything you're doing is to make a pretty grid, and you've got all these gorgeous graphics and everything's like here's my art, here's my art, but you're not talking to them like they're your friends and that you care about them. People shut down, they don't engage. And what you really want is to build relationships with you the authentic real person that you are, that's the most important thing you can do is I hope this makes sense. And I'm not just like spinning it in circles. Like I'm so excited about this stuff. I love talking about it.

Kellee 29:19
QC knitr Do you recommend having a coach or mentor or accountability and getting clarity, using another person as a sounding board? Honestly, that's when my business just exploded was when I finally found my community and started paying for education, I would say of all the things that I've paid for designing a website, designing logos, someone to help me with my Facebook ads, which was a total waste of money because then it didn't sound like me at all. Again, it comes back to knowing yourself and communicating authentically. The money I spend on coaches and really high class courses have been the best one money that I've spent. But you don't have to necessarily spend money on a mastermind or a group coaching programme or a one on one coaching programme. There are other options. For example, Alice Sheridan has a connected artist, it's a membership. And when you're there, you've got all kinds of resources you get, you know, I several times a month, they have coaching, live coaching sessions, you might not get the one on one feedback from the leader of the programme, but you have a group of people that can help support you. So for a much smaller entry point, it's worth spending the money to do that. And if you have the money to spend on a coach, a group coaching programme, my little, I don't want to say, customers necessarily, this is my little mastermind group of people that I really actually consider my friends. In three months, I'm going to take them what would have probably taken three years to figure out. So that's the speed in which it happens. Yes, having coaching can make a huge difference. And honestly, it's almost my opinion, when I've hired a coach. It's almost like therapy, because my husband doesn't want to hear about my business anymore. He's so over like, I don't care what you name it, just make a decision and put it out there. All right. All right, honey, I know you're right. And he's like, No, you already told me that. I know. You're gonna do that. That's great. What else do you want to tell me today? Uh huh. Uh huh. And he's so patient, but he doesn't have advice to give back to me. And neither does your mom or your sister, your best friend who has no clue what it's like to be an artist. You need other artists who know the struggle of self doubt and elation that comes with being an artist. And that's why I say yes, find your group. Whether you're paying for it, you find a free group, you join a smaller, smaller price point membership, I really recommend it. Absolutely. 1,000%. It's the best money I've ever spent. Ah, okay.

Kellee 31:56
And Asimama says about to buy your book excited. Thank you. That's so my book called mixed media colour studio came out last year. Hi, from Singapore with love. It's my first time meeting here. I'm sorry about the time differences. I'm still trying to figure that out, I might start doing five o'clock in the evening. I'm not sure I'm still like looking. So I can hit as many time zones as possible. So she stayed up late just to watch my show. Thank you. And Alison says the book is fantastic. Thank you, you will learn more, just keep following my Instagram. Pay attention to my stories, come for the lives listen to the podcast. And when you have an opportunity, when I have a workshop or my membership, my mastermind not membership mastermind opens up, maybe it'll be right for you, I do have an application process because I want to make sure that you're ready. I don't want to take money or take advantage of anyone who wouldn't be ready. I would rather coach you and teach you until you are ready to make that next leap. Probably by April, I'll have my first workshop and it won't be free. It'll be a small price point. And it'll be like a weekend workshop where you're really going to just like dive into one subject. So you don't feel overwhelmed, one subject to help get your business going. And I have a couple of ideas.

Kellee 33:10
Keystone is my philosophy behind building the like the foundation, with your values, who you want to serve, how you want to serve, what you're willing to do what you know, you're not going to do, I think Keystone is a really important, first foundational step. But I also have my email ecosystem I've been teaching, marketing on on social media, which I really love, especially using live video. So there's going to be some workshops throughout this year as I get my footing, about how and what I want to teach. Whether I'm going to be launching next year with a big course, or a membership, or just keep with just the mastermind and the workshops, we'll see. And your feedback will be very much appreciated.

Kellee 33:51
So I'm gonna wrap this up, since I could probably just talk forever. And we've already been here for 40 minutes, please get on my email list. I have a brand new one called the artists dispatch. That's where the more fiery side spicy side of Kellee will come out. You really want to be on the artists dispatch, but I also have a download for you. So if you want to do a 100 ways to get to make money as an artist without selling your art. There's a free PDF for you to download. And then that'll put you on the artists dispatch as well. And I think you have a lot of other really great questions, put them in the comments after I post this. And then share with your friends, tell everybody to go listen to Unfold with Kellee Wynne I really want this podcast to be a super big hit. Because then everybody will be able to get the message that it's possible and they don't need to be perfect. Right. Okay. Thank you so much, everybody. And I will see you again next week.

Kellee 34:49
Hey, thanks for sticking around to the end of the episode. I'm glad that you hung in there with me on Unfold. If you enjoy this Q & Asession, then I'm going to invite you to come join me on one, all you got to do is pop on over to Instagram and follow me at Kellee Wynne Studios. And this Thursday, April 21. I'm going to be live at five which means 5pm. Eastern time, just come hit that circle ring. I'll be live talking to you. And you can ask me anything. That's interesting you right now about the podcast about how to build an art brand. The questions that you have, I'll be there to answer for you.

Kellee 35:27
Hey, and one more thing, the Virtual Art Summit is coming up. And if you haven't heard about the Virtual Art Summit, it is not to be missed this annual summit that I host once a year has 16 artists giving you high quality instruction and talking to you about how they found their voice. And the best thing about it is that you can choose between pay what you can or keep forever price. So it's available to everyone, no matter what your budget is right now. Head on over to Virtual Art summit.com/go get your name on the waitlist because may 2 We open and it's going to be a full month of great content, interviews, lessons and prizes and scholarships. So yeah, Virtual Art summit.com/go. Go get on the list, and I'll be looking forward to seeing you in the virtual studio. All right, talk to you later. Bye.

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